Stop Being Terrorists! (This might interest Rabbi Bahia...

"It might be good to find out why hundreds of millions of people on three continents, stretching from Morocco on the Atlantic to the Philippines in the Pacific, are so pissed off about Israel. Now, I am not talking about your everyday run-of-the-mill anti-Semites - you can find them on all seven continents, including Antarctica. No, I'm talking about a perceived notion that we Americans are supporting Israel in its oppression of the Palestinian people. Now, where did those Arabs come up with an idea like that? Maybe it was when that Palestinian child looked up in the air and saw an American Apache helicopter firing a missle into his baby sisters bedroom just before she was blown into a hundered bits. Touchy, touchy! Some people get upset over the pickiest things. Is that any reason to dance in the streets when the World Trade Center falls to the ground?

Of course, many Israeli children have died, too, at the hands of the Palestinians. You would think that would make every Israeli want to wipe out the Arab world. But the average Israeli does not have that response. WHy? Because, in their hearts, they know they are wrong, and they know they would be doing just what the Palestinians are doing if the sandal were on the other foot.

Hey, here's a way to stop the suicide bombings - give the Palestinians a bunch of missle-firing Apache helicopters and let then and the Israelis go at each other head to head. Four billion dollars a year to Israel, four billion to the Palestinians - they can just blow each other up and leave the rest of us the hell alone"

Michael Moore "Dude, Where's My Country"

RE: Stop Being Terrorists!

>"Hey, here's a way to stop the suicide bombings - give the

>Palestinians a bunch of missle-firing Apache helicopters and

>let then and the Israelis go at each other head to head. Four

>billion dollars a year to Israel, four billion to the

>Palestinians - they can just blow each other up and leave the

>rest of us the hell alone"

Not bad, or just end the zionist occupation of Palestine by sending the eastern european rejects and western eurpean wannabees back to their German/Polish or Brooklyn homes! Good riddance to bad rubbish!

RE: Stop Being Terrorists!

I'm pretty sure it's been established that there was no dancing in the streets when the World Trade Centre collapsed. CNN, to its shame, showed footage from around 1996 of Palestinians getting very happy in the streets, and reported it as if they were dancing on 9/11 at the news of the World Trade Centre. I understood that there had been a rather grovelling retraction of the story shortly afterwards, which got lost in all the washup from the attack, but the retraction was not done quickly enough to stop the original story from being broadcast worldwide as if it were true.

RE: Media Manipulation

>I understood that there had been a rather

>grovelling retraction of the story shortly afterwards, which

>got lost in all the washup from the attack, but the retraction

>was not done quickly enough to stop the original story from

>being broadcast worldwide as if it were true.

Ditto for the scenes of joy in Baghdad when the statue of Saddam came down!

RE: Media Manipulation

Well, axe, you're the one with the best connections to the Palestinians - was I right about the dancing in the streets after 9/11 being a media lie?

RE: Media Manipulation

Uh, I saw the live TV coverage of the Saddam statue coming down. It was IRAQIS who were trying to pull it down or saw it down, and then some Americans finally came by and pitched in by hitching the statue to a tank and pulling it from its pedestal. Once it was finally down, it was IRAQIS who were kicking and spitting on the statue, and trying to hammer it into bits.

Except for the members of the deposed regime, I think there are a LOT of Iraqis who are happy that Saddam is gone, in spite of the current problems. It's an ugly situation (as so many people predicted) but it won't last forever. Of course, I don't know if the U.S. has the perserverance to stick with this project to the bitter end. We've certainly ducked and run before. But if we do stick it out, and do the job right, Iraq could develop a workable democratic system.

RE: Media Manipulation

Well, I don't doubt the dancing in the streets. We saw the Iraqis dancing just last Sunday when the Chinook helicopter was downed, killing 16 soldiers.

Incidentally, where did Iraq get all those tons of ammuniton that are just laying around now? Did Al-Qaeda supply them with those shoulder-fired missiles after their uprising in Afghanistan! Shame on them... or whoever supplied them!

RE: Media Manipulation

The news article I read said that they were Russian missiles.

RE: Media Manipulation

>Well, I don't doubt the dancing in the streets. We saw the

>Iraqis dancing just last Sunday when the Chinook helicopter

>was downed, killing 16 soldiers.

The sad part is that just as the White House sold a lie to the American people that there was a pre-War link between Saddam and Al Queda, some poor fools like Rabbi Trisexual have bought the big lie about the toppling of the statue. BBC and other foreign news outlets have disected the CNN footage frame by frame, and what is clear is that there was only a handful of Iraqis anywhere near the site. As folks who know anything about cameras can tell you, by taking close ups you can make a small crowd look like a large one. I guess that's why Dick Cheney went to meet with the Hollywood emprasarios before the war began.

Of course, the costs to the lives of innocent poor young black and hispanic Americans from this jewish neo-con sales job and exercise in public delusion are unfortunately very high indeed. Normally, when I feel welcome somewhere I don't hide behind walls, wear body armour and walk around toting m machine gun, but I guess Rabbi Trisexual has had a different experience living in and visiting the zionist occupied Palestinian lands.

RE: Media Manipulation

the palestinians that were shown celebrating on 9-11 did happen; arafat (a billionaire according to 60 minutes last night) even apologized for them saying that they were just children who did not know what they were doing.

the BBC is a totally unreliable source and highly anti-US; i am not sure how you can analize digital tape "frame by frame". except for saddam supporters and bathist party members, most of the people of iraq seem happy to see saddam and his crazy sons gone. the kurds do not have much positive to say about saddam and neither do the shities; the sunni area which benefited from those murders has another view and even there most seem to be relieved that saddam is gone. the tape i saw showed young iraq men trying to pull down the statue when the americans arrived to give them help.

as the mass graves are found and tales of horror come out, saddam was not much loved. as the people see the splendor in which he lived while they suffered (remember the 100,000 children who we were told died because of the american embargo) they are discovering the truth about the regime. saddam's home video tapes showing lavish parties are being sold in iraq and the people there are finally getting an accurate picture of saddam.

as for the BBC, i suggest reading blogger andrew sullivan at http://www.andrewsullivan.com; as a brit, he constantly exposes their bias and lies; they are almost a joke and their viewers are declining in numbers.

RE: Media Manipulation

We should read a self-loathing homophobe so that we can learn about the fallacies of the BBC? Really.

RE: Media Manipulation

>the BBC is a totally unreliable source and highly anti-US; i

>am not sure how you can analize digital tape "frame by frame".

....

>the tape i saw

>showed young iraq men trying to pull down the statue when the

>americans arrived to give them help.

The digital film was compared to film from other cameras with a wider focus over the same time period. From that it could was clear that CNN was trying to create the sense of what took place in Romania or in Berlin, but it just didn't happen like that. There were a handful of Iraqis surounded by U.S. troops who did the heavy lifting. Somehow, that's not what I recall from the Eastern European scenes at the fall of communism. Pretending otherwise just paints you as fool, perpetuates this sad colonial experiment and sentences more of your innocent countrymen to death.

RE: Media Manipulation

>the BBC is a totally unreliable source and highly anti-US; i

>am not sure how you can analize digital tape "frame by frame".

The BBC is unreliable compared to what? CNN, Faux "News"? If you watched either of the latter you got the idea the anti-war protests here were nothing and that they were opposed by approximately equal numbers of pro-war counter-protesters and had little idea about other protests around the world.

BBC is news as it should be. Trying to be fair to all sides and as accurate as possible is a somewhat liberal idea in itself. VS. creating the echo-box around everything the right-wing says, running with the assumption neocons and big business are always right, and shouting down other viewpoints as our favorite US "Far and Balanced" (HA!) "news" source operates.

Of course you can analyze video tape frame by frame, digital or not. Every second of video is made up of ~25 or ~30 fames (sometimes fractionally less, hence the ~).

RE: Media Manipulation

>We should read a self-loathing homophobe so that we can learn

>about the fallacies of the BBC? Really.

You are seriously an imbecile. Andrew Sullivan has been as openly and publicly gay and as openly HIV-positive as it's possible for a person to be for years and years. Everywhere he goes, and on every topic he speaks, he vigorously and uncompromisingly condemns anti-gay bigotry and argues passionately and eloquently for full gay equality. He has been doing so since before it was fashionable. Literally, you have to be fucking retarded to call him "a self-loathing homophobe."

All of you complacent, do-nothing faggots who sit back in your little gay ghetto enclaves and never once stand up for gay equality anywhere where doing so is controversial or difficult - and then sit back and throw eggs at people, like Andrew Sullivan, who do exactly that, to your great benefit -- are truly sickening.

You hate his ideology because he's a traitor to your Liberal Religion? Fine. Go ahead. But to call him a "homophobe" as he crusades for gay equality everywhere he goes, including places which you would be afraid to get near, really reveals how stupid and intellectually dishonest you are.

RE: Media Manipulation

i do not agree with alot of what andrew sulliven says and find it wrong for an HIV+ man to be barebacking. that aside, his site has alot of good links and he makes many valid points. you do not have to like andrew sulliven to find the BBC reporting slanted and not accurate.

aside from being on the spot personally when a news event occurs, any report will have some slant or bias from the reporter to the editor. there is that old japanese movie where several people see the same event and as each tells the story, it is different. however, the BBC has lost much credibility in that its reporting is so far off the mark. they lost me when they described bin laden as a saudi disident and mentioned nothing about being a terrorist and killer of thousands.the andrew sullivan site continually points up the nonsense that the BBC spews and often their lame attempts at correction of misleading or wrong reports.

RE: Media Manipulation

>The BBC is unreliable compared to what? CNN, Faux "News"? If

>you watched either of the latter you got the idea the anti-war

>protests here were nothing and that they were opposed by

>approximately equal numbers of pro-war counter-protesters and

>fractionally less, hence the ~).

Fox news, in my opinion, is simply a right-wing, ultra-conservative propaganda machine cleverly (or not so cleverly) disguised as a news network.

However, I totally disagree with your assertion regarding CNN's reporting of the demonstrations. They reported the anti-war demonstrations daily and throughout each day leading up to the war. The footage I saw showed thousands upon thousands upon thousands of protesters against the war. Very little mention was made of pro-war rallies and the few stories I saw indeed commented on how small they were. And most of the "pro war" rallies I saw reported was usually on Fox news.

RE: Media Manipulation

And you are seriously ignorant. Just look at your own comments to see the self-loathing homophobe within. you don't even need a mirror. And it's people like you that glorify Andrew Sullivan, because you both hate who you are.

RE: Media Manipulation

i hardly "glorify" andrew sullivan. i find his sexual behavior out of line as i said. however, his site provides a good oportunity to read some different points of view. it gets kind of boring only talking to people who agree with your point of view.

reading his blog does not make any gay man self-hating.

RE: Media Manipulation

Well, it didn't take a BBC dissection (assuming there ever was one; Auntie S has a habit of making up facts in his postings) to know that there was hardly a Berlin Wall-sized crowd at the toppling of Saddam's statue. The whole thing went on for several hours and I saw most of it live on CNN. So did hundreds of millions of other people around the world. There was a small crowd of Iraqis, probably about 100 - 200 people or so, trying to pull the statue down. Initially it was fewer, maybe 20 - 30, but the crowd grew as time wore on. The cameras frequently panned back on the whole scene, and it was obvious that the traffic circle where the statue was located wasn't jam-packed with people. It's not surprising that the crowd wasn't large; this happened on the first day of the fall of Saddam's regime and the American entry into Baghdad, and there was still fighting going on. Most people were staying home and keeping their heads down for fear of more shooting. In fact, it's surprising that the people who tried to pull down the statue came out so soon to do that. It says something about their loathing of Saddam that they'd take the risk of being shot at just to topple a hated symbol.

Anyway, once again Auntie S has demonstrated his penchant for trying to generate a polemic where there's no basis for one in the actual facts. He's also grossly misrepresented CNN's coverage of the event. For that matter, I'm not sure if the camera work was even CNN's! At the time they were depending on video feed from some of the Arab channels, as I recall, and voicing over their own coverage. So there wouldn't have been any CNN control over the live images of the attempts to demolish the statue. But even if it was CNN's cameras, the coverage was clear that it wasn't a gigantic crowd involved. That doesn't mean that most Iraqis aren't glad that Saddam is gone, even though the price has been high. (But the price would have been high if the Iraqis themselves tried to overthrow Saddam. And the price of living under Saddam was high, too, with hundreds of thousands of Iraqis murdered, or killed in Saddam's insane wars, or gassed in the Kurdish territories.)